Government shutdown

kg4kpg

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So, you think it's going to happen? I do. I want Obamacare to go just as much as anyone else, but considering we have a legislative branch and can't work together, I'm getting really tired of losing my job for them. Personally, the healthcare issue is a dead issue until republicans can control both houses. Let it go now, save face, repeal it after we get control next year. The democrats will not role over on their illustrious president, no matter how many of them don't like the HC plan.
Needless to say, I'll probably be unemployed again next week, unless someone can start a war so I can get deployed and make some real money.
 
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I hope the government shuts down and America defaults on all loans and hyperinflation (read: where it costs a million US dollars to buy a Big Mac) takes root.

The government won't exist when people stop being paid in a currency that can actually put food on the table.

Everything comes to an end. It is our time.

Iacta alea est.

 
I seriously doubt the gov't shuts down. Republicans will cave, it's all just a game to get media attention and win the next election.

If it does shut down it won't change much. They'll still wage their wars and print their money and pay themselves. They'll just make sure it annoys people so they cry out for the gov't to come back and work together.
 
flareback said:
I seriously doubt the gov't shuts down. Republicans will cave, it's all just a game to get media attention and win the next election.

If it does shut down it won't change much. They'll still wage their wars and print their money and pay themselves. They'll just make sure it annoys people so they cry out for the gov't to come back and work together.

This. It's a threat tactic, but they are in no danger.

Btw, great avatar, Flareback! :thumbsup: ;)
 
None of them have the cojones to shut anything down. This is theater and relies on the commoners now knowing exactly what these boobs are voting for or against.

If the government shuts down, does that mean the NSA stops reading my emails and the TSA stops fondling grandma? :?
 
John Canuck said:
If the government shuts down, does that mean the NSA stops reading my emails and the TSA stops fondling grandma? :?
lol, that's a good one. Like they'll stop their tyrannical policies. No, They'll just shut down things like national parks. Things that really don't cost much at all compared with the NSA and TSA pedophiles. They may send a few of the TSA gropers home just to slow things down and annoy people so that they cry and whine for the gov't to come back so they can get molested quicker.
 
Okay, so apparently I was wrong, sort of. They partially shut down the gov't. But like I said, they would just do things that annoy people. Case in point, they shut down the WW2 memorial. This place is outside and made of stone. It needs no lights or tour guides. Why did they have it blocked off? Just to annoy people.

http://benswann.com/breaking-veterans-k ... -shutdown/
 
Unfortunately if it's not resolved in 17 days, I have no idea where my income will originate being a disabled vet and student using my educational benefits I paid into. I'd rather see it all gone and go all Patriots before I give Obummer the satisfaction of his damned healthcare plan.
 
PCShogun said:
As long as you have a deficit, you are going to be raising the debt ceiling.
The way I see it, as long as the gov't can print all the money they need they will keep raising the debt ceiling. If the money were on a gold standard they wouldn't be able to keep printing it and they'd have to stop spending.
 
flareback said:
PCShogun said:
As long as you have a deficit, you are going to be raising the debt ceiling.
The way I see it, as long as the gov't can print all the money they need they will keep raising the debt ceiling. If the money were on a gold standard they wouldn't be able to keep printing it and they'd have to stop spending.
This is the big picture and our biggest problem. The just make more thought process is destroying us. This is why the Republicans are making a stance, and Obama Care's train wreck.
 
11B3XCIB said:
Unfortunately if it's not resolved in 17 days, I have no idea where my income will originate being a disabled vet and student using my educational benefits I paid into. I'd rather see it all gone and go all Patriots before I give Obummer the satisfaction of his damned healthcare plan.

The VA appropriations are made a year in advance, so your disability check and GI Bill should be OK. At least that's what I've been told by folks at the VA.

In the interest of being a devil's advocate, I have to ask a question: So you have VA health care for life, at a minimal or no co-pay depending on your rating and subsequent category. You won't ever have to pay the no-insurance penalty even if you don't have a civilian plan. The OMB is projecting overall savings due to the implementation of Obamacare, and even the GOP is including some of those savings numbers in their budget which, somehow, defunds Obamacare at the same time. How exactly is this affecting you? Is it just ideological that poor folks shouldn't have health care or do you feel that you somehow are having to pay for that health care for others?

I'm curious. I hear a lot of folks talking about how they like the idea of the ACA but Obamacare is the worst... when they are the same thing. I hear folks (even clients) on Medicare complain about Obamacare, even though that is effectively what they are on. I'm just confused why folks who are for all the components that make up OCare are against the law as a whole. I understand the folks that are against all of it for fiscal or principled reasons.

In the interests of full disclosure, I'm also a disabled vet with lifetime VA care if I lose my private insurance.
 
rotarymike said:
11B3XCIB said:
Unfortunately if it's not resolved in 17 days, I have no idea where my income will originate being a disabled vet and student using my educational benefits I paid into. I'd rather see it all gone and go all Patriots before I give Obummer the satisfaction of his damned healthcare plan.

The VA appropriations are made a year in advance, so your disability check and GI Bill should be OK. At least that's what I've been told by folks at the VA.

In the interest of being a devil's advocate, I have to ask a question: So you have VA health care for life, at a minimal or no co-pay depending on your rating and subsequent category. You won't ever have to pay the no-insurance penalty even if you don't have a civilian plan. The OMB is projecting overall savings due to the implementation of Obamacare, and even the GOP is including some of those savings numbers in their budget which, somehow, defunds Obamacare at the same time. How exactly is this affecting you? Is it just ideological that poor folks shouldn't have health care or do you feel that you somehow are having to pay for that health care for others?

I'm curious. I hear a lot of folks talking about how they like the idea of the ACA but Obamacare is the worst... when they are the same thing. I hear folks (even clients) on Medicare complain about Obamacare, even though that is effectively what they are on. I'm just confused why folks who are for all the components that make up OCare are against the law as a whole. I understand the folks that are against all of it for fiscal or principled reasons.

In the interests of full disclosure, I'm also a disabled vet with lifetime VA care if I lose my private insurance.

The American Legion service officer told me quote "If the government does shut down, there will be no disability compensation payments after October 1st". I know my Ch 31 advisor told me payments weren't going to stop for the school component, so I don't know what to think. I guess I'll see what happens on November 1st if there is no resolution in 15 days.

I do have the ability to obtain free health care at the VA if I do so choose. However, the wait to get seen is upwards of two months here at the Columbia WJB Dorn VA for primary care. They also are loathe to prescribe pain medication, which for the conditions I was separated from the Army, is a necessity. I have a plan with Blue Cross Blue Shield and use it primarily for prescriptions and my pain management appointments. Our rates have gone up so far about $480 a year.

It's not that I feel "poor people" shouldn't have healthcare; I just think it's not a fundamental right. This country is a constitutional republic in that it doesn't provide for people, but it provides the OPPORTUNITY for people, which is what a lot of people these days have forgotten. It's "what can I get for free" versus "what can I work towards". And I feel like having served my country for a decade, several of those years in a war, that constitutes having "earned" the benefit rather than just being born and possibly qualifying for government subsidies in the form of health care, phones, housing, you name it.

And despite having "earned" the ability to get treated for free with no costs at the VA, I choose to pay for private insurance.
 
My biggest concern is having anything shoved down my throat by this government. Why isn't it good enough for them? Which could also be an impeachable offence if anyone had the balls. All I have seen are stats of rates going up, way up. They are banking on young people getting plans and if they don't, will the program fail? I assume it is no different than insurance companies, the 80% that don't get into a wreck pay for the 20% that do. Socialized medicine, it honestly doesn't work that great around the world. Canadians come across the boarder and pay cash for medical care. Another thing is you simply cant trust government much less THIS administration. Look at all the scandals already. Who is gonna profit from this? Trust me when I say it isn't the American people. This administration cant even run a fair IRS, now they are getting bigger??? We keep raising the debt ceiling to pay for bills we already spent??? We cant keep public parks open but we can bomb Syria?? They cant delay Obamacare to work out the kinks when they themselves are having issue and issue with the program and pushing back aspects of it themselves? This is a trainwreckkkkk.
 
Luckily I didn't get furloughed...yet. ABout 2/3 of our civilian staff are out though. For my education benefits, my Army Tuition Assistance was cut off but I am getting my GI Bill payments.

My main beef with the ACA/Obamacare is the fact that the people sticking us with this are exempt, big business is now exempt, regular working class folks are not, people with no desire to find a job are getting health care on the tax-payers dime. I'm pretty low on the VA totem pole since I don't have a disability but I can use the VA if I want to wait for appointments and pay the co-pay. I have private insurance through my job as well.
I think the republicans are fighting a loosing battle. The Senate will never pass a bill to defund the plan and even if they did Obama would veto and I don't think it would get the 2/3 vote after that. (that is the process, correct?) I think if they want to stop it they need to just pass a budget, see if the ACA fails, then use it against the dems in 2014 and try to take the Senate back. Thats assuming they can keep control of the House.
 
11B3XCIB said:
I do have the ability to obtain free health care at the VA if I do so choose. However, the wait to get seen is upwards of two months here at the Columbia WJB Dorn VA for primary care.

At that rate it might be quicker to transfer your PC team to the Charleston VA; between the clinics in all three counties close by and the hospital itself the only appointments I've had to wait for more than a week were the disability evaluation specialists (ENTs).

They also are loathe to prescribe pain medication, which for the conditions I was separated from the Army, is a necessity. I have a plan with Blue Cross Blue Shield and use it primarily for prescriptions and my pain management appointments. Our rates have gone up so far about $480 a year.

Private docs are having the same issues. Drug-seeking has increased tenfold (I don't have actual stats on that, just anecdotes from docs I know) and lots and LOTS of returning vets are having pain issues. Pain management without opioids generally sucks, and folks who are addicted to opioids and/or narcotic pain meds are often asymptomatic otherwise (as opposed to liver issues or lung issues with drinkers and smokers), making it hard to detect addictions.

It's not that I feel "poor people" shouldn't have healthcare; I just think it's not a fundamental right. This country is a constitutional republic in that it doesn't provide for people, but it provides the OPPORTUNITY for people, which is what a lot of people these days have forgotten. It's "what can I get for free" versus "what can I work towards".

Personally, and until now I really haven't advocated my own opinion, I think it is a travesty that the richest nation in the world (still) cannot provide its citizens with a minimum level of health care. Add to that the fact that HC in the US costs multiples of what it should due to fraud, waste, abuse, and profiteering, and our HC system is just pitiful for everyone but the few who can afford the "Cadillac" plans or are otherwise independently wealthy. Sure, folks come to the US to get stuff done at the best clinics in the world... Rich folks. Just like here, if you've got money, you can see the specialist you want. If not, you're left with whatever your HMO/PPO/pocketbook can afford or is 'in network'.

Having said that, I don't think the ACA is a great, or even good, solution. I was one of those advocating for a single-payer system. Sure, in some places you have shortages... but then again, women in the UK can get breast implants on the NHS if they get a diagnosis that their self-esteem suffers without (Daily Mail link, UK Netdoctor). Folks talk about Canada and the UK, but no one ever mentions Japan. Japan has a national health service too - instead of employers paying a portion of employees' premiums to private insurance companies, they pay it to the government. The government uses that economy of scale to pay for the health system. Due to that, the premium/tax per person is much less. When I lived there, I had to buy-in to the system to use it, and as I wasn't technically employed (student) I had to pay full rate of what an employer would pay for me... about $700/year. That is for full coverage no deductible no fees ever for anything medically required including meds, and when I needed a doc I got to see one same day or next day at latest. The average premium subsidy most US employers pay per worker to their insurance plan is about $4,000 (http://kff.org/other/state-indicator/single-coverage/), and that still leaves the worker with their portion of the premium + copays + caps + meds.

I like the idea of universal health care for citizens. I accept that in order to pay for such a thing, everyone must have insurance or pay something into the system for the privilege of not having a plan (like in Massachusetts, where this idea was pushed by Romney and is working pretty well). I do not really like how the government wonks have decided to pay for this program, because in the end I think it will end up screwing people over just as bad as the current system - our government can f@#k anything up.

I do not like that the system we currently have is rife with problems, and instead of sweeping away and rebuilding we're just patching potholes, and I'm talking about the ACA and Tort Reform and Medicare/Medicaid etc. - all of it.

In terms of welfare in general, well, I work with a lot of poor people. I mean dirt poor. I don't meet many that aren't working some way or another. Folks that are on housing assistance, and food aid, and medicare(aid?) in many cases because they're that poor. None of them are really gaming the system for free stuff (although I have yet to meet someone with an Obama/Reagan free phone). I don't meet many of the stereotypical 'welfare mothers' and there's a lot of talk among attorneys that serve the impoverished that that stereotype is fictional. Not to say that some folks don't game the system - far from it.

And I feel like having served my country for a decade, several of those years in a war, that constitutes having "earned" the benefit rather than just being born and possibly qualifying for government subsidies in the form of health care, phones, housing, you name it.

And despite having "earned" the ability to get treated for free with no costs at the VA, I choose to pay for private insurance.

You can remove the quotes from around the word earned - no one (within sanity) will argue that vets have paid for their benefits in advance. Those folks who do argue for cutting vet benefits are neither rational or ethical, regardless of political party.
 
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