Wet Gun

bigfutz · Aug 12, 2012

So what are the most reliable guns to have on you if you know you're going to get really wet? Heavy rain, submerged, etc. And what do you need to do to prepare it and keep it running? Is there any particular type or a certain feature you should look for in ammo? I've heard tales of soldiers in Viet Nam using "protection" on their M16 muzzles.

Midnight Raver · Aug 12, 2012

bigfutz said:
I've heard tales of soldiers in Viet Nam using "protection" on their M16 muzzles.

Actually started doing that during WWII, among other uses.

Interesting topic though, I'm all ears on this one!

jaybird · Aug 12, 2012

This was developed by a Navy SEAL. Looks interesting

http://www.froglube.com/roothome.htm

thebrasilian · Aug 12, 2012

jaybird said:
This was developed by a Navy SEAL. Looks interesting

http://www.froglube.com/roothome.htm

I have a sample of that. I've been think of trying it but am a little worried about anything that tries to impregnate my pistol (no pun intended).

I've always been partial to stainless steel in my guns. But even SS can rust depending on the grade selected. Seen some $1,000+ Kimbers with rust. If you know you're going to be submerging it ammo selection is very critical. They make ammo specifically for that. Chances are though if you're going to be wet because of rain or fog...your everyday ammo should be fine.

Parhams0508 · Aug 12, 2012

For AR's with gas impingement, firing them wet and without draining them is dangerous, right? Isn't that why they've developed the piston system?

bigfutz · Aug 12, 2012

So how about modern pistols? Polymer and (mostly) stainless, recoil operated. I'm mostly talking about reliability when wet, not long term effects such as rust. We've all seen the guys in the movies coming up shooting, water running out of the barrel. As for rifles, I've seen depictions as such with the carbine stocks you can shove a Glock inside.

Tigerstripe · Aug 13, 2012

glocks and others will fire underwater but the bullet will only go about 4 feet, and pretty harmlessly.

http://youtu.be/sbA4um6pORA

and the AR

http://youtu.be/0MA1IFKwdAQ

bigfutz · Aug 13, 2012

Tigerstripe said:
glocks and others will fire underwater

Good info. I guess if it will cycle underwater, then wet would not be an issue. Of course clean it first chance you get. But in a pinch...

bigfutz · Aug 13, 2012

Looks like another related thread started here
viewtopic.php?f=30&t=4565

PCShogun · Aug 13, 2012

Tigerstripe said:
glocks and others will fire underwater but the bullet will only go about 4 feet, and pretty harmlessly

I bet its hell on the old ear drums under water though.

Hamman · Aug 14, 2012

Glock sells a part called a "Maritime spring cup" that actually increases the reliabilty of a Glock that has been submerged.

http://www.glockmeister.com/GLOCK-Marit ... nfo/G3073/

Standard spring cups are solid and will compress the water that may infiltrate the striker channel in the slide resulting in a weak strike.

This could come in handy for you guys and gals lucky enough to win a gator tag and unlucky enough to fall in as you close on your prey.

11B3XCIB · Aug 15, 2012

An M4/AR-15 will function fine after being submerged. They gave us plastic barrel caps to use in Iraq once. If the SHTF, you could just fire like normal and it'd blast it right off. It was to prevent dust from entering the barrel.

Anyhow, back to submerged. If you totally dunk the rifle, go swimming with it, whatever, just tilt the barrel down, gently pull back the charging handle like you're checking the chamber for a round, then release the charging handle after the water has drained. Make sure the bolt is fully seated and you are good.

Regulis7 · Aug 26, 2012

+1 on FrogLube!!! For a working gun like a CCW or woods gun this product is hands down a better choice than CLP or Rem Oil. For a house gun or range toy that may get a sprinkle or two its a bit expensive.

HOLY DIVER · Nov 21, 2012

I've fired AR-15's in pouring rain just to see how they would do. They fire just fine in pouring rain. As stated above if you submerse an AR drain it before fireing. Main thing to remember is to properly lubricate an AR. Over lubrication bad under lubrication bad. If you don't wanna worry about lubrication buy a AK variant lol

PCShogun · Nov 21, 2012

I was thinking the same thing. Just let the water drain from your AK and add more used crank case oil with your knotted shoe laces afterward.

fiundagner · Nov 21, 2012

mythbusters did an episode on something similar.

51 8 "Myths Re-opened"[13] April 26, 2006 (2006-04-26) 62
Myths tested:
Splitting an Arrow, Bullets Fired Underwater, Salami Rocket

I wouldnt want to use any ammo that didnt have a factory crimp on it though. I have heard, but have not personally experienced, that home loaded ammo is less resistant to miosture and may misfire once it has gotten wet. If your ammo gets wet DON'T try to dry it out in the oven (mythbusters episode 85).

I watch a lot of mythbuster apperently

HOLY DIVER · Nov 21, 2012

fiundagner said:
mythbusters did an episode on something similar.

51 8 "Myths Re-opened"[13] April 26, 2006 (2006-04-26) 62
Myths tested:
Splitting an Arrow, Bullets Fired Underwater, Salami Rocket

I wouldnt want to use any ammo that didnt have a factory crimp on it though. I have heard, but have not personally experienced, that home loaded ammo is less resistant to miosture and may misfire once it has gotten wet. If your ammo gets wet DON'T try to dry it out in the oven (mythbusters episode 85).

I watch a lot of mythbuster apperently

Correct never use the oven to dry ammo out the microwave is much faster bahaha lol jk

armaborealis · Nov 24, 2012

I'm a big fan of stainless.

I went on a week plus hunting trip in Alaska in the fall, where it rained every day exept for one.
- Mossberg 500 (for small game): Pretty significant rusting started. Needed TLC upon return to civilization.
- Ruger 10/22, Blued (also for small game): Same deal. Rusting, especially around screws and such.
- Stainless Browning Xbolt: Pristine. Tiny speck of rust on scope base (which was not stainless).

On another trip to kodiak for 10+ days:
- Savage bolt, blued: Rusted. Needed to be cleaned in the field a few times.
- Marlin lever, stainless. Zero rust. I wiped it down in the field with a remoil wipe and ran a patch through the bore just to be safe but it didn't need it.
- Stainless Revolver: Zero rust.

In wet damp conditions it seems hard to beat stainless. I'm a huge fan. I wish Marlin made a 30-30 "guide gun" with 16.25" bbl and stainless finish. It'd be very practical.

PCShogun · Nov 25, 2012

Surprised it rusted so quickly.

Usually a thin layer of oil prevents water from coming into contact with the metal and prevents the rust from forming. I'd say you should take a small tube of oil and wipe your weapons a bit each day to keep it on the metal.

armaborealis · Nov 27, 2012

PCShogun said:
Surprised it rusted so quickly.

Usually a thin layer of oil prevents water from coming into contact with the metal and prevents the rust from forming. I'd say you should take a small tube of oil and wipe your weapons a bit each day to keep it on the metal.

Well, to be fair, things didn't totally rust out over a few days. I did see some noticeable red spots that needed to be removed, though. Areas of concerns were right around screws (like scope mounts), a few specks on bolts, and barrels. Nothing that needed more than a few minutes of cleaning, and the weapons were still usable. The Mossberg was probably in worst shape, which makes sense as it is probably the cheapest blueing.

I think one of the challenges with that particular environment was cold and condensation. EVERYTHING gets damp, everywhere. It is impossible to keep anything dry. We were also in a coastal area with high winds so I don't know if salty sea spray was an issue.

For prevention I went with CLP, and in the field I used a mix of remoil wipes (super convenient) and CLP.