South Carolina's gun laws get worse!

[armaborealis]

Ok, bragging thread... My home state of Alaska is already pretty awesome on guns: Constitutional Carry, restaurant carry, pretty much no extra state hoops on NFA items and so on, strong preemption verbiage, castle doctrine, etc. There are only a few places with better laws, like Utah allowing CCW inside schools.

We just got even better! So, relative to the "gold standard" of state gun laws, I'd say SC's laws are getting even worse and the Palmetto State is falling even further behind!

STAND YOUR GROUND
First, we got a "stand your ground" law passed by the House & the Senate. Alaska already had removed the duty to retreat in several circumstances but this bill removes duty to retreat anywhere you have a right to be. The governor is expected to sign.

FIREARMS FREEDOM ACT
Next, we got a strengthened Alaska Firearms Freedom Act. The new FFA is the strongest in the nation. We already have a FFA that exempts any firearm made in the state that stays in the state from federal oversight. The new law expands that further.

First it expands the list of firearms that are protected to include those that are POSSESSED in the state, not just made in Alaska. It also includes firearms accessories, explicitly including magazines.

The bill then allows the Alaska Attorney General to defend a citizen accused of breaking federal firearms laws. It requires the AK AG to file suit against any new federal gun control legislation.

The bill specifically exempts Alaska residents from any new Federal restrictions on semiautomatic firearms or magazines as well as exempts Alaskans from any new Federal registration scheme.

The bill forbids any Alaska State or municipal agency from aiding the enforcement of anything that infringes on a person's 2A rights or on implementing REAL ID. The legislature clearly states as a finding that banning any firearm or restricting any magazine size violates the 2A, as does registration. The only issue I see here is that this language may arguably prevent local CLEOs from signing off on NFA items; the bill specifically forbids support for any federal registry. Otherwise this is excellent and basically shuts down any state assistance for feds trying to enforce new unconstitutional gun laws.

The original version included verbiage making enforcement of new federal gun control laws a state crime. That wording was removed in the final version, probably to avoid a standoff between the ATF and the AK State Troopers.

This bill may be unconstitutional but there is a case pending on a similar FFA in Montana. We'll see how it works out. It certainly puts the Federal Government on notice and makes Alaska the most firearms friendly state in the union. Our governor has already pledged to sign it.

KNIFE PRE-EMPTION

The state has pre-empted local government from regulation of knives. They actually just added the words "or knife" to our firearms preemption statute so it is solid wording. The only "downside" is that the state did make it a crime to sell gravity or switchblade knives to minors. I think it is a good trade overall. The governor is expected to sign.

We also got some extremely strongly worded statements encouraging the governor to try and get firearms manufacturers to move to Alaska, and a very strongly worded support of the 2A outlining its historical roots and Constitutional purpose of overthrowing despots.



So, when is the Palmetto state going to catch up? Y'all are already a decade behind, Alaska had Constitutional Carry back in 2003!

 

[Avtomat-Acolyte]

Constitutional Carry is good as long as you remain in Alaska. No state reciprocates your state's idea that the 2nd Amendment is valid. If you carry a handgun concealed in another state then you are committing a criminal offense.

 

[Paco]

Alaska issues permits for reciprocity.

 

[Avtomat-Acolyte]

Alaska issues permits for reciprocity.

I know they do. My point was that the gimmick of having a state declare that they will let any non-prohibited person CCW a gun is negated by the reality that you do, in fact, have to apply for, and be investigated prior to receiving, a physical permit issued by the state.

 

[armaborealis]

Alaska issues permits for reciprocity.

I know they do. My point was that the gimmick of having a state declare that they will let any non-prohibited person CCW a gun is negated by the reality that you do, in fact, have to apply for, and be investigated prior to receiving, a physical permit issued by the state.

Eh, I wouldn't call Constitutional Carry a "gimmick."

I can carry in 35+ states without a permit (open carry) and in all or large parts of 8 states concealed (Con Carry) without a permission slip. Indeed if SC voters and gun owners could get on the same page and lobby their reps for better carry laws, I could probably do so in SC as well. For those states which aren't on board with permitless carry wave, an optional permit allows carry in 37 states. I started carrying without a permit, in fact, and only got an Alaska card for reciprocity while traveling. I might not have started CCW without the permitless system, which lowers the barrier to entry significantly.

It is nice to see states moving forward. I hope SC moves forward with at least restaurant carry if not Constitutional Carry. There is lots of bad news from CT, NY, MD, and so on. However, freedom is on the march in many states. I hope SC marches towards more freedom rather than doing nothing and falling further behind the curve.

 

[biganimal]

Alaska issues permits for reciprocity.

I know they do. My point was that the gimmick of having a state declare that they will let any non-prohibited person CCW a gun is negated by the reality that you do, in fact, have to apply for, and be investigated prior to receiving, a physical permit issued by the state.

Eh, I wouldn't call Constitutional Carry a "gimmick."

I can carry in 35+ states without a permit (open carry) and in all or large parts of 8 states concealed (Con Carry) without a permission slip. Indeed if SC voters and gun owners could get on the same page and lobby their reps for better carry laws, I could probably do so in SC as well. For those states which aren't on board with permitless carry wave, an optional permit allows carry in 37 states. I started carrying without a permit, in fact, and only got an Alaska card for reciprocity while traveling. I might not have started CCW without the permitless system, which lowers the barrier to entry significantly.

It is nice to see states moving forward. I hope SC moves forward with at least restaurant carry if not Constitutional Carry. There is lots of bad news from CT, NY, MD, and so on. However, freedom is on the march in many states. I hope SC marches towards more freedom rather than doing nothing and falling further behind the curve.

when you say that you can carry in 35+ states without a permit do you really mean that you can carry without those state's permits because you possess a permit from AK? I must assume that is what you meant as I looked at several state's laws and so far I can only find two states that allow non residents open carry without a permit, AK & VT

 

[forward assist]

I think I prefer SC.
regardless of how free Alaska is, they still have a rape rate 14% higher than the national average and property crime rate 10% higher.
I have discussed this trend with many Alaskans and it would seem the rates are indicative of a higher number of citizens who are criminals and have relocated there. That combined with a male to female ratio only comparable to the Australian outback.
the common response to these ideas is to blame the natives for the high crime rate.

 

[FunkyMonkey]

when you say that you can carry in 35+ states without a permit do you really mean that you can carry without those state's permits because you possess a permit from AK? I must assume that is what you meant as I looked at several state's laws and so far I can only find two states that allow non residents open carry without a permit, AK & VT

No. Open carry without any kind of goobermint permission. NC and VA are on the list.

http://www.opencarry.org

 

[dreamerofdreams]

I think I prefer SC.
regardless of how free Alaska is, they still have a rape rate 14% higher than the national average and property crime rate 10% higher.
I have discussed this trend with many Alaskans and it would seem the rates are indicative of a higher number of citizens who are criminals and have relocated there. That combined with a male to female ratio only comparable to the Australian outback.
the common response to these ideas is to blame the natives for the high crime rate.

...Sooo, what exactly does that have to do with constitutional carry?

 

[forward assist]

That perhaps the reason Alaska had laws regarding firearms had something directly to do with the crime rate compared to the inability for law enforcement to respond, in most cases, in less that 24 hours.
Alaskas sizes and the distance that police have to travel to calls almost requires the citizenship to perform their own pseudo civilian response to crimes.
svery the point wasn't more clear to you.

 

[dreamerofdreams]

What about Arizona and Vermont, then?

 

[John Canuck]

when you say that you can carry in 35+ states without a permit do you really mean that you can carry without those state's permits because you possess a permit from AK? I must assume that is what you meant as I looked at several state's laws and so far I can only find two states that allow non residents open carry without a permit, AK & VT

Virginia requires no permit to OC. There are about 15 gold star open carry states and another and another 15 or so that are very friendly to OC. It's possible that a few of them differentiate between residents and non-residents, but I have my doubts.

 

[armaborealis]

I think I prefer SC.
regardless of how free Alaska is, they still have a rape rate 14% higher than the national average and property crime rate 10% higher.
I have discussed this trend with many Alaskans and it would seem the rates are indicative of a higher number of citizens who are criminals and have relocated there. That combined with a male to female ratio only comparable to the Australian outback.
the common response to these ideas is to blame the natives for the high crime rate.

Our suicide rate is above average too. All three are linked to large remote areas with slow or no law enforcement, and they tend to be concentrated in rural villages off the grid with significant substance abuse issues. Most of the situations also involve domestic violence, not random stranger-danger rape. My spouse doesn't abuse me (or vice versa) and I don't have a drinking problem so it isn't a huge risk factor in my life.

With regard to carrying without a permission slip, check out OpenCarry.org. The majority of states in the US don't require a permit. SC is significantly behind the curve on carry and has been for awhile.

 

[biganimal]

After further research I did find a lot of states that allow open carry but couldn't tell if it was for residents and non residents alike.
Having said that I still prefer SC but hoping ghe laws get changed.
I have family in Alaska and they tell me that quite often it is too cold to shoot at the range. Only 3 things keep me off the range here, hurricanes, work and my wife

 

[beerman]

I do know that Wisconsin and Michigan allow open carry with no permit, I'm sure most of the other states that allow open carry are the same.

 

[Tigerstripe]

in NH my son had to go to, i believe, the sherrifs office, to sign up as a resident to open carry.

 

[FunkyMonkey]

After further research I did find a lot of states that allow open carry but couldn't tell if it was for residents and non residents alike.
Having said that I still prefer SC but hoping ghe laws get changed.
I have family in Alaska and they tell me that quite often it is too cold to shoot at the range. Only 3 things keep me off the range here, hurricanes, work and my wife

I think GA requires a permit to OC. Most allow anyone, resident or not.

I OC'd absolutely everywhere it was allowed in VA (Norfolk) and never got more than the occasional odd look. Had many pleasant conversations because of it. People in OC states that see it regularly become desensitized, realizing that "regular" people OC, not just crooks and cops. In VA you can (and I did) OC in banks, government buildings including law enforcement offices, even town council meetings. Technically one could even legally consume alcohol publicly (although I never did). This is why is it so important to exercise this right when it is available. 35 states allow it and it is not "the wild west".

OC works, and work well. SC needs to get out of the stone age thinking. Government is not the answer

 

[Lupinus]

After further research I did find a lot of states that allow open carry but couldn't tell if it was for residents and non residents alike.
Having said that I still prefer SC but hoping ghe laws get changed.
I have family in Alaska and they tell me that quite often it is too cold to shoot at the range. Only 3 things keep me off the range here, hurricanes, work and my wife

I think GA requires a permit to OC. Most allow anyone, resident or not.

I OC'd absolutely everywhere it was allowed in VA (Norfolk) and never got more than the occasional odd look. Had many pleasant conversations because of it. People in OC states that see it regularly become desensitized, realizing that "regular" people OC, not just crooks and cops. In VA you can (and I did) OC in banks, government buildings including law enforcement offices, even town council meetings. Technically one could even legally consume alcohol publicly (although I never did). This is why is it so important to exercise this right when it is available. 35 states allow it and it is not "the wild west".

OC works, and work well. SC needs to get out of the stone age thinking. Government is not the answer

And thats the nice thing, we're getting there.

If not this year, I predict we'll have it within the next few years.

 

[forward assist]

An open carry law is not a step in the right direction.
it will simply lead to more businesses banning firearms on their property.
SC wants to address its crime problem, it should try focusing on its education system, unemployment, and financial disparity issues.
What is it that makes someone want to publicly display a weapon on themselves?
is it really that bad, the places you go?
I can't fathom the stress that a person must be under being so afraid that they feel the need to wear a weapon out in the open. Or is it insecurity?

 

[carsontech]

Open carry is believed to be a helpful deterrent. The way you hold yourself can be an important deterrent as well, but the open carrying of a gun seems like a great addition to the deterrent effect, to me.

Foward Assist, The other countless states that have open carry do not have big problems with gun signs, that I noticed and from my research. Go on the opencarry.org forum and read the experience of open carriers on there. I've open carried in several states, myself, and I've never had a problem.

Also, I don't think government should do anything about education or unemployment, nor anything else for that matter. Government should be disbanded or privitized, according to my morals. Government means a monopoly on coersion and force, and that seems immoral to me.

Regardless, I believe individuals should be allowed to protect themselves anyway they wish. If that means wearing a gun openly, then so shall it be.