SMITH & WESSON TO END MOST CA SALES

[grayokc]

SMITH & WESSON TO END MOST CA SALES DUE TO MICROSTAMPING REGULATION

On January 22nd renowned gun maker Smith & Wesson joined Sturm, Ruger, & Co., by announcing it would cease California sales of its semi-automatic pistols due to microstamping requirements that went into effect last year.
Ruger made the same announcement earlier this month.
Microstamping is a requirement that each firearm be fitted with a special firing pin that leaves a fingerprint on a bullet casing which differs from the fingerprint of every other firearm. In other words--every one of the wildly popular Smith & Wesson M&P .45 semi-automatic handguns would have to be manufactured in such a way so that no two of them left the same mark on a shell casing.
The cost of doing this would be incredibly high to manufacturers, and would be a cost they would have to pass on to consumers in higher prices.
Moreover, the result of doing this would be yet another gun registry--every gun sold that met microstamping requirements would have be to registered so that the government knew who owned the gun that left that fingerprint.
On top of these things, micropstamping doesn't even work--and least not all the time. There are proven problems with the durability of microstamps on firing pins.
So The Washington Times reports that Smith & Wesson is just going to stop selling guns in CA for which microstamping is required.
Smith & Wesson president and CEO James Debney said his company "will continue to work with the NRA and the National Shooting Sports Foundation (NSSF) to oppose this poorly conceived law which mandates the unproven and unreliable concept of microstamping and makes it impossible for Californians to have access to the best products with the latest innovations."

 

[WillR]

I hope they extend this to law enforcement agencies. What is good for the goose...

 

[Jefpainthorse]

IMHO California wins.

Ruger and SW have both let a huge amount of their models fall off the Californian DOJ approved list. Dealers (and gunbroker type sellers) have been refusing to ship in California for several years.

The State has been trying to make gun owners criminals for years... and it's working. However, the real criminals still do as they please often with impunity from the victims and the plea- happy government lawyers who should prosecute them to the full extent of the law.

Projections:

Since the vast minority of Californians in the North and Nevada border counties are pro gun and rather rural, I expect those folks to become even more serious about forming a political division from the State as it's bordered today. Simply Stated.... they people in the LA and Bay Area can simply out vote those in the balance of the State... and most of the State House people who propose the gun laws (and pass them) are from... LA and Bay area districts

In the meanwhile... those who can will continue to leave in droves. Watch out OKC--- the grandkids of the "Okies" are looking to come home. Nevada and Arizona are seeing a lot of ex Californians moving yearly as is Texas.

The underground firearms market in California will continue to bust open. I'd also expect a huge increase in price for whatever used transferable legal guns left in the State to skyrocket.

Summation:

Smith and Wesson and Ruger have again taken the corporate low road. If those two entities were truly Pro Gun they would simply file the paper work and play the game... and use their corporate clout to re-inforce the will of the Consitution and the honest gun owners of California.

 

[WillR]

I guess the "ghost gun" is the next thing on their dumbass radar.

 

[Josh Beauchamp]

I don't see California winning in this case. Smith and Wesson, Ruger, and all other manufacturers that have followed suit have an obligation to their consumers in the other 49 States where this isn't required. Due to the cost of this unproven technology they would end up having to put microstamped firing pins in all firearms. Further more these "finger prints" have to be registered with the government which leads to a backdoor registration of all legal gun owners. Conservative Californians and business are leaving the State in droves and the push for the State of Jefferson is increasing.

 

[Scott Hearn]

IMHO California wins.

Ruger and SW have both let a huge amount of their models fall off the Californian DOJ approved list. Dealers (and gunbroker type sellers) have been refusing to ship in California for several years.

The State has been trying to make gun owners criminals for years... and it's working. However, the real criminals still do as they please often with impunity from the victims and the plea- happy government lawyers who should prosecute them to the full extent of the law.

Projections:

Since the vast minority of Californians in the North and Nevada border counties are pro gun and rather rural, I expect those folks to become even more serious about forming a political division from the State as it's bordered today. Simply Stated.... they people in the LA and Bay Area can simply out vote those in the balance of the State... and most of the State House people who propose the gun laws (and pass them) are from... LA and Bay area districts

In the meanwhile... those who can will continue to leave in droves. Watch out OKC--- the grandkids of the "Okies" are looking to come home. Nevada and Arizona are seeing a lot of ex Californians moving yearly as is Texas.

The underground firearms market in California will continue to bust open. I'd also expect a huge increase in price for whatever used transferable legal guns left in the State to skyrocket.

Summation:

Smith and Wesson and Ruger have again taken the corporate low road. If those two entities were truly Pro Gun they would simply file the paper work and play the game... and use their corporate clout to re-inforce the will of the Consitution and the honest gun owners of California.

Jeff,

While both Ruger and S&W are true corporate entities, they aren't really that big financially speaking. Having worked in manufacturing for years I can understand completely why they won't even attempt to comply with this foolishness. It would be a serious increase in manufacturing and the related documentation. There's no way they could recoup that in the price of the gun.

I'm with WillR. I posted in a Facebook thread last night that S&W, Ruger, Glock, Sig, SA, and all the rest should form a coalition and agree to just stop selling to these states altogether. All of their agencies period. If they hate guns so much that they won't allow their citizens to have them, then they shouldn't have them either. That would stop this nonsense pretty quick. It would be a hell of a lot quicker than a lawsuit.

 

[WillR]

Barrett already doesn't sell to anyone in CA. Became their policy years ago when 50 cal was outlawed for us lowly citizens.

 

[Burk Cornelius]

IMHO California wins.

I kind of agree with Jeff here. If everyone starts pulling out of states that implement dumbass laws (i.e CA, CO MA) then in those people minds they just won. They got the guns out of their state.

A better solution would be to get rid of the dumbasses that wrote the laws like CO is systematically doing (albeit too late).

Pulling out, although admirable, only lets the anti-gun crowd dig in their foothold in those particular state. What we don't want to end up with is a "GUN USA" and a "NON_GUN USA".

It's all 'Merica!

 

[Jeff T.]

... What we don't want to end up with is a "GUN USA" and a "NON_GUN USA".

It's all 'Merica!

Isn't this kinda what happened a couple hundred years ago with Great Brittian and their colonies ?

 

[Jefpainthorse]

In California it's not just guns. Water rights, goofy agricultural rules, and the fact that the taxpayers front for every welfare hack and illegal in the State... it's getting pretty vocal in places like Placer, Mono and El Dorado Counties.

Yea... I understand that Smith and Wesson and Ruger are not financial giants. Ruger and Smith were the two biggest players to give up back in the 90's two. These two will be the first to take advantage of the NRA and tell you how they support gun rights... in this case the other "49" are holding there own.... California needs a wake up call from the rest of us.

The Senator from Texas just introduced another version of CCW recip ... If we pass that kind of thing it's a start.

It's a big picture deal here... we need to make it hard for these "liberal states" to function with the rest of us. Colorado had help from a lot of outside resources in getting those "recalls" .... and the outside pressures and support of gun owners in Illinois helped to turn that CW issue.

Remember.... a lot of NON GUN Californians are migrating out for a lot of other reasons to places like Nevada, Texas and Oklahoma. They will be bringing a lot of libtard ideas with them. In Nevada... ex Californians are a great deal of the political problems we have and why Las Vegas keeps sending Harry Reed to the Senate. What can happen here can happen any other place these people land.

We are all in this together.

 

[Jefpainthorse]

Scott ... I appreciate what you said. However you may not be aware of this.

The California DOJ has a list of acceptable guns that can be sold in the State. It's a nightmare by design. A handgun or rifle may be "legal" by merit of a wooden stock... the same action sold in a composite stock is "illegal" if sent with a sythetic stock. A "two tone" finish on a pistol is not the same as the same pistol in stainless steel, etc. Once your product on the list ... your product is removed after 3 years unless your company re fliles papers to keep it on the list.

Is it a overt attempt by the State to put a burden on sales and distribution of a legal product? You betcha. I am a big advocate of "states rights" but in California's case the DOJ list is a corruption of the concept. The will of a large segment of the population is against it- and it certainly benefits the criminal element in California by default.

So my question to you, Scott- If SW and Ruger are going to drop off the list how long before Kimber, Colt, Hi Point, Kel Tec and everybody else do to? Giving up based on "return on investment" is a valid business principle... but in the long run Ruger and SW have started a nail in the coffin that will be driven home by others.

 

[rmuller]

If colorado would not have screwed the pooch when becoming a state then California would not have the water rights to the colorado river, and would therefore be a desert. I dunno, i guess it is nice to have a nice open area for all the crazies to stay.

Does the law read that the gun must be sold with a microstamp on the firing pin? or cannot be sold with a firing pin that that does not have microstamping.
Wondering if there is an easy skirt to the law IE "Here is this gun, firing pin and accessories sold seperately".

On another note the law is being fought currently on the basis that the technology to microstamp firing pins is either not available or not feasible for production purposes. a clause in the law.

 

[Scott Hearn]

Yes my theory is "pie in the sky" thinking, I get that. It would only work if ALL of the manufacturers here AND abroad got on board which is as likely to happen as water running uphill. But I've learned in life that people have to be slapped upside the head to get their attention in an awful lot of cases. If the politicians could not have guns to protect themselves or to arm their security and LEOs it would mean that they have to live with the very same dangers that they are foisting upon their subjects. That would be a pretty stinging slap IMO. The CA DOJ is exactly what fuels my ire. Also all of the libs moving out of these cities and states are concerning, of that there's no doubt. And I do understand CA politics, I lived and worked in Orange county for 2 years. Get outside of the 3 counties that run the state and the people are not any different than us, except that they might have stronger stomachs for tyrannical laws than we do, or more likely they just don't pay attention because they are doing well themselves.

But in my own perfect world, I would not sell even a black powder cap & ball revolver to any CA State agency or department just on principle. Let them sleep in the bed they make and it'll get cleaned up post haste.

 

[technetium-99m]

I can't wait for the day Glock tells California's LEO's to pound sand. That day will never come but I can dream.

 

[Scott Hearn]

I can't wait for the day Glock tells California's LEO's to pound sand. That day will never come but I can dream.

It would be one hell of a party wouldn't it?

 

[Dustin Cantrell]

This is a loss for gun owners. Gives the anti gunners one more foothold. I'd say more but most has already been said or is common sense.

 

[Scott Hearn]

And Glock joins the party! <----Click it!

So I guess I don't understand their dumbass law. Why do existing models get a pass? I'm assuming they do, but too lazy don't care enough to go look it up.

 

[Wall]

wouldn't one quick pass with a file remove any stamp on the firing pin anyway?

 

[Scott Hearn]

wouldn't one quick pass with a file remove any stamp on the firing pin anyway?

Yep. Maybe two passes to be "safe".

What I want to know is what happens when brass picked up off of a range gets dropped at a crime scene? Probably 100 other reasons why this won't work.

 

[scubor2]

I want mine to dimple my primers with a happy face.