Proposed bill would revoke need for carry permit in Oklahoma

Jeff said:
Bingo.....i may have a right, i also have to be respectful of others and responsible

The last 20 years have added so much regulation to make things ironclad that common sense has been regulated out of existsnce

The GCA is all the gun law we need.... just enough to make interstate commerce work- after all, buying a gun by mail order could make things crazy
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Even the GCA is too much regulation.

What do you have against mail-order guns, Senator Dodd?

After all, allowing any joe schmo to carry without training and a class session and then a permit signifying completion could make things crazy.

Do you realize just how crazy that statement sounds?

Blood in the streets! The world is ending!

At least make a rational argument instead of just saying you're scared
 
LuckyDucky (Spencer) said:
So you want to ban transfers without background checks and records then so we can track where guns go easier?
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What I'm saying is.....I dont know why we do 4473 forms. With the way we ship stuff, pay for stuff the paper trail makes a 4473 redundant.

If a gun was mailed to a person who used it in a crime... the data is enough to figure out a lot

Walls right... the criminal goes to the street for his guns.
 
Great discussion!
I personally am a constitutional carry believer. The 2a says "shall NOT be infringed"
I personally will probably never open carry. I was still glad the open Carry bill passed.
The criminals will always be able to get guns, they're criminals.
I believe the law abiding citizens of this country need to have the ability to exercise ALL the rights guarenteed to us by our founding fathers.
You don't want constitutional carry? You don't have to carry! It's not about opinion, It's about LIBERTY!
 
Should there be a required safety course with range time for those that plan to carry if this bill were to pass?

I would like to attend a safety class with range time and get a license after the class without all the wait time in the current system and at a lower cost.
I do understand you guys that want the Constitutional Carry, and I understand why. It does make sense, but I would still want a class of some kind.
It just seems logical to me to know that the person you see with the gun has maybe had some kind of training or testing. I mean when a guy is in
the military they are trained, police officers and security personel are all trained. I expect the same requirement at some level to be able to carry in public.
I know I can carry on my own property now, and I have some training beyond civilian, but I would never carry in public without the proper crossed t and dotted i.
 
StealthESW said:
Should there be a required safety course with range time for those that plan to carry if this bill were to pass?

I would like to attend a safety class with range time and get a license after the class without all the wait time in the current system and at a lower cost.
I do understand you guys that want the Constitutional Carry, and I understand why. It does make sense, but I would still want a class of some kind.
It just seems logical to me to know that the person you see with the gun has maybe had some kind of training or testing. I mean when a guy is in
the military they are trained, police officers and security personel are all trained. I expect the same requirement at some level to be able to carry in public.
I know I can carry on my own property now, and I have some training beyond civilian, but I would never carry in public without the proper crossed t and dotted i.
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No.
 
Osbi brought in over 6 million dollars last year issuing permits. I doubt you'll see a law stopping that cash cow.

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I am always aware of my surroundings....the first OC I see is the first person i put in my condition yellow list. WHY? Because I take for granted they don't know a disconnector from a mag spring. The 2A is the only one that allows the rest to exist, but if you think for a second all gun owners are created equal then you are a FUKING MORON>

IF that isn't clear enough, THEN no i don't think all americans should be allowed to carry as they see fit. I see you at Crest with a AR strapped getting bread...guess who is the first fool I'm watching.......
 
StealthESW said:
Should there be a required safety course with range time for those that plan to carry if this bill were to pass?

I would like to attend a safety class with range time and get a license after the class without all the wait time in the current system and at a lower cost.
I do understand you guys that want the Constitutional Carry, and I understand why. It does make sense, but I would still want a class of some kind.
It just seems logical to me to know that the person you see with the gun has maybe had some kind of training or testing. I mean when a guy is in
the military they are trained, police officers and security personel are all trained. I expect the same requirement at some level to be able to carry in public.
I know I can carry on my own property now, and I have some training beyond civilian, but I would never carry in public without the proper crossed t and dotted i.
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I will phrase this as gently as possible.

Do you really think the CCW test is a measure of public carry skills or represents any sort of bona fide training?

Do you really think that any one in the "military" has some sort of edge in a civilian situation? ( with the exeption of 11 series types and a few other "operators" residing in other Branches?)

Security? Police?... As a group... not such a great bunch of examples for any thing gun related.

See... this Freedom and Responsibilty thing makes "thinking people" hire some good training and participate in regular practice with a measurable value of some sort.

When we trust the State to mandate training we get a commitee- made product that "passes", as compentent, any body who fires 50 shots at a barn wall without shooting someone else in the class. Law enforcment (basic stuff) is not much better.

Any "honest" CCW instructor will tell you this, it's his job to get a student over the legal hurdle as imposed by the State. Nothing more or less.

The Same Conservatives and Libertarians who would sponser "full A2 rights" are the first to encourage individuals to spend time in quality training .... if your thinking the STATE will mandate "quality training" or responsibility on a personal level .......
 
OUshooter said:
I am always aware of my surroundings....the first OC I see is the first person i put in my condition yellow list. WHY? Because I take for granted they don't know a disconnector from a mag spring. The 2A is the only one that allows the rest to exist, but if you think for a second all gun owners are created equal then you are a FUKING MORON>

IF that isn't clear enough, THEN no i don't think all americans should be allowed to carry as they see fit. I see you at Crest with a AR strapped getting bread...guess who is the first fool I'm watching.......
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So... do you pull off the road when some tooth-less red neck in a beater car gets near you in traffic to let them pass.

Emotions and passion is good.... but if it takes an OC to put you on "condition yellow".... I really don't know how your reality works. A tee shirt over a gun still leaves a gun in the mix... I kinda like to know who's got what.

Ya see... ever since permits for carry existed on a "shall issue basis" the smart money on "situational awareness" is "every body is packing"... that's the logic- cover the gun and bad people figure the odds are bad for them. Problem always has been... the "bad people" cover up too.
If your going to spout Cooper's color codes.... the old man figured "yellow" was a near full time situation in modern public places.

Reading the "sign" (along any trail) is probably more important than knowing a disconnector from a mag spring. Equality among gun owners is a 'strawman' argument at best if it's used to justify rights by law. A few years ago the sporting shotgun and Norfolk jacket boys became what we call "Fudds" using the same rational. An yea... the average Joe in a gun shop today is a moron... so I really don't get your point. Accept it- there is a Hi Point out there for everybody and those buyers outnumber you at least 10 to one.

Hyperbole is your freind .... take a ride to Phoenix and count the AR rifles in the supermarkets and get back with me.
 
Jeff said:
If your going to spout Cooper's color codes.... the old man figured "yellow" was a near full time situation in modern public places.
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You are right on the mark. I didn't think alot of things through on that post. I appreciate the feedback. You make some good points...gonna rattle it around in brain a bit more.
 
Why are we trying to pass more laws?! The US Constitution ( highest law of the land ) already says the people (you and I) already have the right (not licensed privilege) to keep an bear ( own and carry) arms (weapons not only firearms) for the purpose of well regulated militia.( Militia's use machine guns, precision rifles, automatic rifles, hand guns, sub machine guns, molotov cocktails, grenades, bombs mortars shoulder fired surface to air rockets and lightly armored vehicles and frankly any other arms they could procure and maintain) If this is already the law of the land then any laws that infringe on it are already unconstitutional and therefore irrelveant. We dont need yet another wag of the finger law to back up what the second ammendment already says. If anything, we should cut the fat and simply remove the laws that infringe on the it and go back to the legal process before any laws were passed against these arms. Making another law just tells the government that we the people know they stepped over the line and we just stepped back (AGAIN) and made the same line in the sand and said dont step over this new line like you did the last one that we did nothing about when you crossed it . Its cute but completely pointless as they dont even follow the highest laws of the land to begin with. I say until we "show some teeth" and make some consequences for infringing on our rights and repeal the laws we have then anything else is just pissing up a rope.
 
Why do we need a license or testing for a right? They tried this with voting. It was ruled unconstitutional too as it is a right. What is next free speech permits to make sure dumb people dont say stupid things? people constantly talk about how much they love freedom. But it seems the only freedom they are interested in is their own. I think these people will soon learn that if they only fight for their freedom and disregard others, then when they need help no one will come to their aid just as they did.
 
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