poopgiggle
B Class Nobody
That could be an issue with the source of randomness used for the random numbers, but random numbers will still have patterns like that.tbarker13 said:
You can't really have random numbers AND a distribution that you want.
Prize Table Discussion
- Thread starter bsdubois00
- Start date
You can't really have random numbers AND a distribution that you want.
Burk Cornelius
Regular guy
dr poopgiggle said:
Perfect answer. Random isn't always Random
tbarker13
Well-Known Fanatic
That's true. But if we are using a random starting point, it doesn't matter how we set up the grid. Hell, you could let people pick their numbers (not that I'm suggesting that), and it would have no effect whatsoever on the randomness of the awards.dr poopgiggle said:
But separating peoples' entries would remove the disadvantage/penalty suffered by people who find their entries bunched together.
A random starting point combined with a random distribution of entries doesn't make the process any more random.
poopgiggle
B Class Nobody
what?tbarker13 said:
tbarker13
Well-Known Fanatic
I'm saying that if I went through and manually inserted every name into a slot on that excel list, it would have had no impact on the randomness of the prize drawing.
That was handled by the random number generator.
That was handled by the random number generator.
tbarker13
Well-Known Fanatic
Dr. Poopgiggle, you were randomly assigned #s 116, 162 and 303 on the entry grid of 511 numbers.
And then we had the random number generator give us #122 as the starting point.
It doesn't matter if our initial entry numbers are random or not. All that matters is that we have a random starting point on that entry grid.
We could have let you pick any 3 numbers you wanted, and it still would have been a random awards process. That is, unless you have the ability to predict the future to know that #122 was going to be the number spit out by the random number generator.
And then we had the random number generator give us #122 as the starting point.
It doesn't matter if our initial entry numbers are random or not. All that matters is that we have a random starting point on that entry grid.
We could have let you pick any 3 numbers you wanted, and it still would have been a random awards process. That is, unless you have the ability to predict the future to know that #122 was going to be the number spit out by the random number generator.
bsdubois00
Head Honcho Emeritus
tbarker13 said:
I understand - but then it wouldn't be completely random would it? I used excel to generate random numbers and that's what determined the order. If we are starting to move numbers around we are messing with the true definition of random.
desert_gypsy
Well-Known Fanatic
I'm pistol-whipping the next person who says "random."
poopgiggle
B Class Nobody
If you allow people to pick their own numbers:tbarker13 said:
1. You actually can game that process, and
2. It creates additional management overhead for a guy who's already doing this for free in his spare time.
E: random
tbarker13
Well-Known Fanatic
I don't see why it would mess with that definition.B.S. DuBois said:
Take the lottery, for example. Do you have any better chance of winning the lottery using randomly-generated numbers versus those you pick yourself? Of course not.
As long as you are using a random number generator to pick the starting point, then it's random. There is no reason to think any of the numbers between 1 and 511 are more or less likely than any other to be chosen by the number generator.
grantwoodok
Well-Known Fanatic
As a first time participant I think the whole process with spreadsheet and random number generation works fine from what I've seen.
My only suggestion/comment would be for first time folks set they expectations of how the drawing takes place and how long it take to process through the list. I thought that the dial-in call last week was it and all was going to being given away at that time so when the called ended I was asking WFT just happened...
NOW I know how it works!
AND Brandon don't buy at IKEA you'll regret it when you have to put all that **** together!
Thanks admins who run the show I know from being involved with Internet Brands on previous forums it's a LOT of thankless work.
Maybe we can send Feegee to Houston for a week to help you out!
Oh and this "random" thought... I love BACON!
My only suggestion/comment would be for first time folks set they expectations of how the drawing takes place and how long it take to process through the list. I thought that the dial-in call last week was it and all was going to being given away at that time so when the called ended I was asking WFT just happened...
NOW I know how it works!
AND Brandon don't buy at IKEA you'll regret it when you have to put all that **** together!
Thanks admins who run the show I know from being involved with Internet Brands on previous forums it's a LOT of thankless work.
Maybe we can send Feegee to Houston for a week to help you out!
Oh and this "random" thought... I love BACON!
tbarker13
Well-Known Fanatic
1. I specifically said I'm not suggesting we let people pick their own numbers. (and I'd love to see the explanation of how a person could game the system if we did.)dr poopgiggle said:
2. I also offered to do the work in my own spare time.
E. Random, Randomly, Randomness,
poopgiggle
B Class Nobody
It's not like the lottery where there's just one number and you have to try to guess what it is. There's a starting point, and then you move down n picks from the starting point. Arranging your picks then becomes strategic. The strategy obviously depends on the specific rules for how the picking goes (what you do with the entries of people who have already won, for example). Then you have to decide a pecking order for who picks when, and get people to respond, etc.
If you want to do this yourself then more power to you.
If you want to do this yourself then more power to you.
Matt1911
Cyrwus Jr.
Quit effing with **** that ain't broken.
hunter_dmw12
Well-Known Fanatic
Start moving the complainers to the bottom. This prosses works just finefine. If you want more entries get your ass out and shoot more matches. Participate in the forum and you would find out how this works. And take it from me sometimes it is good to be last. Brandon the prosses works there us no need to fix it.
zombiegirl
Well-Known Fanatic
I think it's fine....I know it'll be awhile...I'm ok with that...I for one do appreciate everything this site has done for me...I've met some really great people...shot some really awesome matches I would have never attempted without the help of the peeps here....I've learned so much about equipment and ammo ect....I'm very thankful for everything BS has done for me and to wear their jersey to some matches and possibly get a prize at the end of the year.....totally awesome dude!!!!
Tech
Well-Known Fanatic
Only if you use a black spade multiplier. A red spade wouldn't be fair.
tbarker13
Well-Known Fanatic
Not sure if you mean me as a complainer.Mike wolever(hunter_dmw12) said:
Just to be clear, I'm not complaining about what happened to me and the prize table. I'm quite happy with that.
And I think there were 7 people who shot more matches than me this year while wearing a Boomer Shooter shirt. So there's that.
But hey, if it's bad form to even bring up a possible change in the "Prize Table Discussion" thread, then I apologize.
I made a suggestion. And certainly meant no offense to Mr. DuBois. And now I'll drop it.
