Whats your long term plan

Dubs Chops · Feb 8, 2011

OK Not zombies, =[ But what would be your long term plans for survival for you and yours if TSHTF for real. I mean government loses total controll due to whatever circumstance. Do you have a place to go? do you have a way to provide food and water for you and yours? Do you have the proper defenses to keep it from getting taken from you?

I think thinking about these things is good. I believe having this mindset is crucial to helping you survive.

ChickenGlock · Feb 8, 2011

place to go? if I had to get out of the city and wanted to try and travel I have a place ~3 hours away to go...that place isn't going to fall apart as that community if you will is very self sustainable. proper defenses? I have ways to defend but even if me and my other half were both fighting how long can we fight or how many can we fight off before we lose?

nobody would be able to hold out forever

Airic · Feb 8, 2011

Zombie said:
I have a place ~3 hours away to go...that place isn't going to fall apart as that community if you will is very self sustainable.

I know most people would scoff at the notion of Hollywood/TV showing anything to do with survival or SHTF situations, but I always think of the show "Jericho". I always had the opinion that a lot of the smaller towns in Oklahoma would be self sustainable, and react like the town in that show. Hell my hometown has its own powerplant.

Dubs Chops · Feb 8, 2011

I think you could sustain long term fine if you were prepared. Here is the deal. I also believe small communities will have to be formed in order to succeed in long term survival. it will take people banding together with the same mindset. Unfortunately most people will not ever have that type of mindset until after it has happened. But say you have 100 acres well fortified with about 50 acres of it in gardens and crops. you could sustain yourself off of that and hunting for quite some time with a basic knowledge of food storage. Then for security you would obviously need guard posts and Observation posts. But I think it could be completely doable.

Eellis · Feb 11, 2011

You have 3 options, go take everyone elses stuff , fight daily to defend ur own stuff, or disapear. The choice is yours!

jtischauser · Feb 11, 2011

Eellis said:
You have 3 options, go take everyone elses stuff , fight daily to defend ur own stuff, or disapear. The choice is yours!

I'm going on offense. I'd rather be the hunter than the hunted.

KillShot · Feb 11, 2011

As I've said before, in a TRUE situation when the elephant dung hits the fan, the only currency that will matter will be a bullet. Ammunition or the lack thereof will determine how long you will survive because it will enable you to defend your family as well as barter for necessities such as food, water, and other tangible items.

In a long term situation, you would do well to have something like a Katadyn water purification system because the body can sustain itself for days without food but without water, you will quickly become dehydrated and your body will begin shutting down.

The people buying gold fail to remember one simple fact; only one bullet is needed to take all the gold you have in your possession.

Dubs Chops · Feb 11, 2011

I agree with you on ammunition but also silver for when things do become more stable after the first 5 years or so.

KillShot · Feb 11, 2011

I don't think it would take 5 years for things to stabilize and order to be restored but during the period of time of an economic collapse, it could get pretty bad.

Dubs Chops · Feb 14, 2011

Even if it was not 5 years, I think the more things stabilize the more silver would be a better bartering item than ammo.

ExSniper · Feb 14, 2011

Hard to imagine any SHTF scenario that has the USA so screwed up we all have to head for the hills. With that kind of power vacuum in the US, what do you think the rest of the world will be doing? How do you intend to get to someplace 2-3 hours away? What do you think all of us folks out in the sticks will be doing when folks start heading our way?
Probably more realistic to determine survival strategies for staying out and defending where you are.

DoctorJJ · Feb 14, 2011

I think the notion of any amount of land being "fortified" and defending it is fantasy. How many people do you think it would take to properly patrol and watch for thieves or invaders 24/7? I've got me and my immediate family, which if my brother happens to be in town, is 3 able bodied men. That's counting my dad, who was 101st Airborne but at this point is a shadow of his former self. I think we would be lucky to defend against one home, let alone 100 acres. Sure we own a few hundred but keeping it secure all the time is farcical.

steak · Feb 14, 2011

I'm heading to pitcher, I figure no one really wants to be there so I could have have it to myself. I will just have to get some casting equipment.

SMS · Feb 17, 2011

DoctorJJ said:
I think the notion of any amount of land being "fortified" and defending it is fantasy. How many people do you think it would take to properly patrol and watch for thieves or invaders 24/7? I've got me and my immediate family, which if my brother happens to be in town, is 3 able bodied men. That's counting my dad, who was 101st Airborne but at this point is a shadow of his former self. I think we would be lucky to defend against one home, let alone 100 acres. Sure we own a few hundred but keeping it secure all the time is farcical.

Ditto...it'd even be hard to secure a large farmstead 24/7 - 365 with a platoon....keeping in mind folks will have to be working, tending crops, getting water, improving facilities/defenses etc from dusk till dawn and more in addition to pulling security and patrolling to maintain situational awarness of the area. More numbers means more resources required just to get by. Not feasible in a truly non-permissive environment IMHO.

Seclusion, inaccessability and standoff from anything close to a main line of communication or population center is the only place feasible for a small group.

benjamin-benjamin · Feb 17, 2011

i have no plan whatsoever, i enjoy living my life without worry, i don't really spend anytime stressing about things that "might" happen or things i can't control. my life is wonderful and God has blessed me with a great job, awesome wife, 2 really awesome dogs (black labs)....

KillShot · Feb 17, 2011

benjamin-benjamin said:
i have no plan whatsoever, i enjoy living my life without worry, i don't really spend anytime stressing about things that "might" happen or things i can't control. my life is wonderful and God has blessed me with a great job, awesome wife, 2 really awesome dogs (black labs)....

There's a difference in being worried or stressing about things out of our control, and having some sort of plan of preparedness if or when something goes awry. Those who fail to make any kind of preparations will have a lot of explaining to do to their wife and/or kids when the elephant dung hits the fan and they want to know why their daddy/husband didn't take measures to ensure their safety or survival.

SMS said:
Seclusion, inaccessability and standoff from anything close to a main line of communication or population center is the only place feasible for a small group.

That's my take on it, too.

Dubs Chops · Feb 17, 2011

I agree it would take a few people to make a large plot of land dependable. for 100 acres I would guess you would need at least 100 abled bodied people. very few places will be able to sustain that kind of population on the given amount of land. But what is near that plot will help a lot. Plus you have to remember the defenders advantage of somewhere close to 7:1. I will be heading to the country from a small suburb outside of the city. You know what the locals are going to do when they see me coming? Open the gate. Because it is my families property. I have begun to take steps to prepare for my family in certain circumstances. Will/Would we be able to hold out and make it? Possibly, And then again maybe we wouldn't make it a week. Depends on how bad it gets. I am going to say I feel I will have a much better advantage than someone with NO plan for them and their family. I would not want to be traveling with my family hoping to find some place secluded that will provide me with food, shelter, and water along with a defend able area. That is Just crazy. Besides that what if you can't find a place? How much food water and ammunition can you carry for you and your family?

Believe it or not I think that measures can be taken to help boost the odds in your favor to survive a coming collapse or natural disaster of greater proportions than we have previously seen. Its all in the Planning and the Prep.

benjamin-benjamin · Feb 17, 2011

KillShot said:
There's a difference in being worried or stressing about things out of our control, and having some sort of plan of preparedness if or when something goes awry. Those who fail to make any kind of preparations will have a lot of explaining to do to their wife and/or kids when the elephant dung hits the fan and they want to know why their daddy/husband didn't take measures to ensure their safety or survival.

don't want to turn this into an OSA like thread, so i will just say this. I am not sure what everyone is expecting, that we are going to go to bed and without warning the next morning there are no jobs and everyone is zombies?? if something happens i will cross that bridge when i get there, but i cannot think of any situation where without any warning at all, everything in society collapses.. so if things start going in a certain direction then i will start taking steps, but today feels no difference than 10 20 or 100 years ago..

KillShot · Feb 17, 2011

benjamin-benjamin said:
don't want to turn this into an OSA like thread, so i will just say this. I am not sure what everyone is expecting, that we are going to go to bed and without warning the next morning there are no jobs and everyone is zombies?? if something happens i will cross that bridge when i get there, but i cannot think of any situation where without any warning at all, everything in society collapses.. so if things start going in a certain direction then i will start taking steps, but today feels no difference than 10 20 or 100 years ago..

No, I don't believe we'll wake up to no jobs or as you put it, everyone is zombies. I do believe that it's very likely that our financial system could collapse, rendering the dollar utterly worthless. If you don't think so, take a look at history and see what happened after the stock market crash of 1929. I don't dwell on the whole idea of what to do if or when the SHTF but I do keep it in the back of my mind.

By the time any of us receive a warning, it may already be too late which is why it's good to have some sort of plan in place. No, you can't plan or prepare for everything but some plan today is better than no plan at all. Case in point; before the blizzard hit Oklahoma a few weeks ago, you could buy basic staple items anywhere. The minute a warning was delivered, you couldn't find anything with which to make a meal if it required milk, eggs, bread, etc.

JRSherman · Feb 17, 2011

What I think a lot of people fail to realize when it comes to farming is that there would be no large scale crop farming to worry about or guard. The reason being, diesel quantities won't last long enough to sustain even small scale farming when using diesel/gas powered equipment. If it's bad enough that this country shuts down, it will do just that. Shut down. No semis hauling tankers of gas/diesel to your nearby station.

If you think you're prepared to plant and harvest even 20 acres(which I think is a decent amount of property that could feed a small group of people year to year) of crops without powered equipment, you might as well shoot yourself now. Not to mention, finding 20 acres of half decent fertile land in anything outside of river bottom territory is going to be a PITA. You can't just run up into the mountains to the nearest box canyon and drop trou on good ground, it doesn't work that way. I pray like hell that if S were to HTF everyone runs to the MO and AR parts of the Ozarks mountains, because that leaves the better areas open to people with a growing brain. That opening scene in Josey Wales where he was plowing isn't nearly accurate as to how many rocks are in the ground up there. They probably hauled in dirt just for it.

Like KillShot said as well, you're going to need water. Anyone with half a brain will know this when SHTF, and will regulate any decent sized spring fed sources. What's that mean to me? I'm not going to count on Roaring River for a water supply without boiling the hell out of it or filtering it. Personally I think filtering it is adding something else you have to carry. If you already have the ability to make fire and a bowl out of something, just boil it.

Bullets as a commodity? I don't see it. Plenty of preachers and snake worshipers survived in the great westward expansion somehow without them. They did so on the small amount of pity in someone else's heart. Just because you have bullets and a gun doesn't mean you're going to run out in a day or kill off everyone else you meet. I'd rather have a few hundred rounds and the ability to evade being found than 10k rounds and my own mountain top.

Lest we forget something I've stated since I learned about the world and some of the history in the last few hundred years. If S ever H'sTF in this country, I think you'll find that all of our allies suddenly remember that they were our enemies at one time, and that they've got something to gain once again.

Just some ramblings from a young hillbilly who's listened to some of his elders that lived through the Depression and otherwise. Take them as you like, they're just my opinions.